observation and a question

[Sandswich]

I noticed a parallel between the bullfight and the gunfight at the end of the movie. During the bullfight, Sands says, (this is not an exact quote because I don’t own the movie ) “The bull is stabbed, beaten…the bull is wounded before the matador ever enters the ring.” Then thanks to the rigging of the game, the bull ends up killing the matador. At the end of the movie, Sands is like the bull in that he is severely wounded. Yet he still manages to win the fight with the two cartel guys.

My question (unrelated to the observation): Ok. Could someone please explain WHY Sands trusted Ajedrez? This never made sense to me. You could argue that it was because she was a government agent. After all, so was Ramirez. But Sands knew that Ramirez had been working against the cartel for years. What did he know about Ajedrez? There is an implied sexual relationship between them. Other than that, I can’t recall anything about her that would make Sands trust her. You could also argue that he needed her to help him take down Marquez. But once again, why trust her?? I can’t believe that he was in love with her. I also don’t want to believe that he was stupid enough to be distracted by her looks (although one of his t-shirts said otherwise ). Any thoughts?

[CIA Agente Arenas]

SJ's got so much irony, it's insane. Most obvious example would telling Chicle Boy that he never wanted to see him again. I wouldn't be surprised if there was another tangent between him at the end and the bullfight.

As for your question, the biggest problem with OUATIM is that it doesn't give a good look about what happens beforehand. There's no history for Sands and Ajedrez so you kind of have to guess as to their relationship. I'd bet they were bed mates, but again, Sands trusting anybody besides himself doesn't seem to fit a pattern. But I think I'm biased by the stuff I read about him.

[Dangerbabe]

I think it's more about Sands underestimating Ajedrez than actually trusting her. I don't think he trusts her, he thinks she can be bought. Sands is bribing her with a share in an enormous amount of money--more than she could ever earn as a cop. And she shows all the signs of taking the bait. Not to mention, I'm sure the sex is good.

He doesn't know she is Barillo's daughter. That is his downfall. Ajedrez is good, has learned from the best. She knows how to cover her tracks. As a matter of fact, I'd say she and Sands are equals--Sands just learns his lesson faster than she does. She is the one who underestimates him at the end...and pays for it with more than her eyes.

[Sandswich]

SJ's got so much irony, it's insane. Most obvious example would telling Chicle Boy that he never wanted to see him again.

Good point!! I never noticed that. (Your sig is a little scary. )

I think it's more about Sands underestimating Ajedrez than actually trusting her. I don't think he trusts her, he thinks she can be bought.

Ok, that makes sense. Poor Sands. He should have had some help down there. I imagine he wouldn't have wanted any though.

[CIA Agente Arenas]

Hehe, thanks, Sandswich.

I just found out that 20 million pesos is a little over a million American dollars. The majority of people (at least around here) don't play the lottery unless it's 50+ million. Just the same, Sands says he's willing to share the spoils, he'd probably get a larger share... Ajedrez can still waltz away with $500,000; nothing to be depressed about by any means. As a cop in Mexico, that's awesome. As the daughter of Barillo though, would she realistically have been able to feign interest in half a million? (I know she can, but would she? )

[The Caribbean Crusader]

Here's my !

1. The agency that Ajedrez worked for (to me anyway)looked like the equivalent of the USA's ATF... so they would be all over taking down a cartel. That would give Sands a reason to trust that she wouldn't be working for one. But then again, I could be wrong about her agency.

2. I agree with DB about him underestimating her. Like she said, he "really didn't see it coming."

3. That is an awesome parallel between the bullfight and the gunfight. Sandswich, you go! I never noticed that, but it's absolutely perfect. Robert, did you do that on purpose?

[Sandswich]

CIA said:

Hehe, thanks, Sandswich.

I just found out that 20 million pesos is a little over a million American dollars. The majority of people (at least around here) don't play the lottery unless it's 50+ million. Just the same, Sands says he's willing to share the spoils, he'd probably get a larger share... Ajedrez can still waltz away with $500,000; nothing to be depressed about by any means. As a cop in Mexico, that's awesome. As the daughter of Barillo though, would she realistically have been able to feign interest in half a million? (I know she can, but would she? )

See I never realized she was a cop in Mexico. This is why I need to buy the DVD.

3. That is an awesome parallel between the bullfight and the gunfight. Sandswich, you go! I never noticed that, but it's absolutely perfect. Robert, did you do that on purpose?

thanks

I have one other question...I thought you could pretty much just pop an eyeball with a sharp object. Isn't it mostly liquid? In other words, why did they have to use a drill on Sands?

[CIA Agente Arenas]

You won't regret it.


I still haven't found great links about the AFN, so I'm still working out what exactly Ajedrez was in terms of law enforcement, but as soon as I stumble across something, hopefully that'll help some.


Yes, the way I hear tell of it, the eye is mostly liquid. And from my sig, it'd have to guess it's some kind of joint plucker/popper instrument... I think that (and this is personal opinion, I know next to nothing about the eye) it's supposed to scramble the nerves and in essence... liquify everything that wasn't already liquified. Charming. Try this place on for size, it's got pictures and in depth anatomy of the eye. Then you can draw your own conclusions.

webvision.med.utah.edu/anatomy.html

[Dangerbabe]

Yeah, I figured it was a sort of stabber/grabber/slicer, thingy that basically held the eye and then sliced the optic nerve and connecting tissue at the back. Nasty no matter which way you...er...slice it.

[Sandswich]

Thanks for the eyeball info! And sorry it's taken me so long to respond. School is winding down for the semester, so I am somewhat buried in work. No time for Johnny.

[Dangerbabe]

That's okay, Sandswich! You just come around when you can.

OMG, I love your sig! ;D

[Secret Pseudonym]

I always just figured that they wanted to make the procedure as painful as they possibly could, and that was the reason for the drill bit. I mean, just the thought is painful. Usually an enemy that is beaten and scared is easy to take down. Sands however seems to be abnormally stubborn.

[Dangerbabe]

Gotta love him for that ... poor blind bastard.